tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post5951367181922751179..comments2024-03-06T08:29:13.333-08:00Comments on stuff white people do: wonder whether describing a condom as a "sombrero" is racistmacon dhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07795547197817128339noreply@blogger.comBlogger66125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-67502225488998567352010-04-22T13:35:10.815-07:002010-04-22T13:35:10.815-07:00I had this discussion earlier this week but I thou...I had this discussion earlier this week but I thought I might belatedly contribute anyway:<br /><br />With all due respect to the poster above, who actually is Mexican, I feel it is offensive because of the context, including U.S. cultural context, in which the sombrero analogy is being used. It takes sombreros, something Mexican men wear on their heads (even if only for "really weird occasions," as 'nothing to see here...' put it), and analogizes it to something to cover a penis. Most Americans don't know that sombreros are only worn on rare, special occasions but even if they did, it's still a cultural symbol uniquely identified with Mexico. And that's why it matters.<br /><br />Given that I belong to a group that is subjected to hypersexualized stereotypes and their attendant ramifications (on interpersonal as well as institutionalized levels), I'm more attuned to the offense of reducing an entire people, or men of color, to associations with genitalia. It's not just about avoiding offending Mexican-descent kids (b/c I'd be offended too) - it's about the inherent disrespect of a taking highly-identifiable cultural item, from a non-white culture, and sexualizing it in a (white) culture that <b>already</b> subjects Mexican culture and people to ridicule, and that uses sexualized stereotypes to justify promoting cultural/racial inferiority (e.g., blacks are more sexual => less self-restraint => less civilized => more animalistic, therefore ok to treat as inferior (and all that that entails)). It would feel like more of the same: <i>See? Their hats can be used to demonstrate what a properly-applied condom looks like!</i> (Not to mention the comments that would ensue if the target of the ridicule was wearing one - or any time pictures of Mexican-descent males wearing the hat were shown, e.g., <i>Mexicans wearing sombreros look like dickheads!,</i> etc.) <br /><br />It creates yet another opportunity for disrespect. It trivializes a non-white cultural symbol and diminishes the pride Mexican-descent kids might feel in such a culturally-recognizable item by applying it in an inappropriate context.* They don't need any more fuel added to the fire. Why not analogize it to a Stetson?<br />_______<br />*And, as has been pointed out before on this blog, the action is <i>inherently</i> objectionable, not just because of the offense it might cause the Mexican-descent kids. We all lose out.TABnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-66074057227721759702010-03-06T09:31:53.994-08:002010-03-06T09:31:53.994-08:00ok, so for some people it might actually be racist...ok, so for some people it might actually be racist, especially for mexicans or as it said a mexican or latin american kid in a american school, americans might look at him/her or have another perspective of them. I'm mexican,and i leave in mexico; and let me tell you, i don't find this racist or anything, i mean we mexicans don't even use those sombreros, i find them ridiculous by the way, its just a traditional thing no one uses (just in some really weird occasions).<br /><br />so.. i don't think it is racist or anything.nothing to see here, folksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-54273402062113878152010-02-19T09:41:47.166-08:002010-02-19T09:41:47.166-08:00Was it intended to be racist? No. It is not racist...Was it intended to be racist? No. It is not racist. Problem solved.JewishLumberjacknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-75171632843172600962009-09-24T17:07:57.994-07:002009-09-24T17:07:57.994-07:00It was described in terms of a hat with no racial ...It was described in terms of a hat with no racial connotation. And i find it to be quite ironic that a blog named "stuff white people do" even brings up such a topic. maybe you're the racist and you are pulling at strings to find any kind of connection to whites and racism and to your fanatical beliefs, which you have to validate to yourself every once in a while even with such absurdities.Blowfishnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-52014015378778242052009-09-09T22:44:46.462-07:002009-09-09T22:44:46.462-07:00As a Mexican who loves her sombrero... some people...As a Mexican who loves her sombrero... some people just need to get their Politically Correct Panties out of a knot.<br /><br />The only thing that could have possibly offended me is that "Terry" admitted that the word "Mexican" also brings to mind the word "lazy".<br /><br />I'll call that ignorant.<br /><br />I'm what I like to refer to as a "Gringa Mexicana." As much as I'd like to be Chicana (one of those Spanglish-speaking Mexican Americans running around all over the southern states), I never will be. So I can say that the true Mexicans - you know, all those illegal ones everyone wants to kick out of the country - work harder than I probably ever have, or ever will.<br /><br />So by all means, "que se duerman abajo del cactus, hermanos! Lo merecen!"<br /><br />And remember, if you want to kick them out of the US, you'd better learn to fix your own roof, immaculately manicure your own lawn, and break your back in 100-degree heat building that Starbucks you want to order your frappuccino in.<br />(A bit of a distracted tangent, but I just thought I'd throw that out there.)MsSexyMexynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-30224815191712197632009-08-16T15:02:11.144-07:002009-08-16T15:02:11.144-07:00@beatriz, you obviously misread my comment. Becaus...@beatriz, you obviously misread my comment. Because while we ultimately come to different conclusions about whether or not the condom-sombrero reference is ok, you and I are making the same point about the origins of the word.<br /><br />My post (which probably falls into "too long didn't read" land) states explicitly that Mexican isn't a race, that a sombrero is a hat, that the word predates the colonization of the americas and is used throughout to describe a variety of different hat styles. As someone who considers herself to be mestizo, and who comes from a mestizo family from South America, I really didn't need your lesson about race and colonialism in modern Latin America. I've spent years giving that schpiel to people who want to know why I have a spanish surname but am not more "indian looking". <br /><br />And I don't really buy your argument that since straw hats like those worn by Zapata and painted by Rivera were also worn by the first wave of Mexican immigrants to the US (which discounts the Mexicans living in the US when big chunks of it were still part of mexico?) saying that a condom looks like a sombrero would someone make their descendents feel oppressed. <br /><br />I maintain that sombrero sounds good, and within the context of the united states is widely understood to mean a hat with a rim and a rounded top, and thus a good analogy for a condom.<br /><br />but if people are really so upset then maybe "old lady gardening hat" would be preferable, since the hats worn by old ladies when they garden also have brims and rounded tops. and the old ladies who wear them come from everywhere.julesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-16768190864926690572009-08-15T20:41:03.216-07:002009-08-15T20:41:03.216-07:00As a privileged person w/ no Spanish-influenced ba...As a privileged person w/ no Spanish-influenced background...<br /><br />...the only thought of yours that really struck a chord w/ me was the idea that it might single people out.<br /><br />Otherwise, I don't think of the stereotypes...I just think of the shape, since that's the context...so I'd be pretty much w/ your 4th commenter, "RMJ."<br /><br />But see above about who I am.<br />(Though I strongly disagree w/ cowboy hat, since they're not symmetrical all around and could cause a lot of harmful confusion if that disconnect causes people to fail to remember easily how to use a condom. Say "w/ a brim" or something and let people at least not end up w/ wrong-shaped brims in their heads.)Katiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02468513750052527691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-68512023260653166672009-08-15T20:37:22.921-07:002009-08-15T20:37:22.921-07:00"Hat with a brim?"
(Funny thing--most of..."Hat with a brim?"<br />(Funny thing--most often what I hear called "condom caps" by people wearing hats they think look stupid on them are knit <b>beanie</b>-form hats!)Katiehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02468513750052527691noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-76523866330091750072009-07-12T14:35:41.383-07:002009-07-12T14:35:41.383-07:00Analogy time
sombrero:mexican person
condom:penis...Analogy time<br /><br />sombrero:mexican person<br />condom:penis<br /><br />if we make condom=penis, by extension it looks like we are saying<br /><br />mexican person=penisNhttp://afrodescendiente.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-80630655163795344332009-07-12T09:52:19.935-07:002009-07-12T09:52:19.935-07:00I know this has already been commented on ages ago...I know this has already been commented on ages ago, but I couldn't resist. A sombrero is a wide-brimmed hat used to keep the sun off your face. I wear one to the beach all the time. For me, as a Spanish speaker, that is what it is, a wide-brimmed hat. It is not only a Mexican word, but perhaps this is the most familiar Spanish speaking group for Americans, and which I personally find, quite honestly, a little closed-minded and slightly annoying. But, if using the word 'sombrero' incites racist stereotypes in people's minds, then by all means, just say wide-brimmed, pointy hat. Who could be offended by that? My two cents.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-11100813134820169872009-07-07T15:14:49.430-07:002009-07-07T15:14:49.430-07:00@ Moira
Funny comment, smart too.@ Moira<br /><br />Funny comment, smart too.SeasonVelvethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00039523140889823409noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-71248701140660760292009-07-06T17:44:21.935-07:002009-07-06T17:44:21.935-07:00Great info Beatrix, thank you. You seem to agree w...Great info Beatrix, thank you. You seem to agree with Macon's concerns as expressed in the remembered/transcribed convo. That this association is one best left avoided. <br /><br />I do too. No hurt feelings possible taht way, among people for whom feelings can hurt very much.<br /><br />(And hey, I sure did learn a lot about hats here! LOL)dereknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-64327192294002536822009-07-06T17:14:03.566-07:002009-07-06T17:14:03.566-07:00Giles:
what it means to be Mexican, and what thin...Giles: <br />what it means to be Mexican, and what things symbolize this trait, varies in and outside Mexico. Saying something wouldn't be considered defining (or racist) in Mexico (where Mexicans are dominant) doesn't mean it isn't so for Mexicans or descendants of Mexicans living outside the country. Obvious example: in Mexico we devote more effort to celebrate September 16, Independence Day; Mexicans in the US make a bigger deal about May 5, the Anniversary of the Battle of Puebla. They're both national holidays, but one is significant when you're <i>in</i> Mexico , the other when you are (or grew up) away from it.<br /><br />myblackfriendsays: "racish" is indeed awesome and has endless potential for use.<br /><br />Jules and macon d: "sombrero", literally "shadower", means "brimmed hat" in Spanish, a language that predates the conquest of the Americas. Before the Spaniards came here, Mexicans did not, as such, exist. Modern Mexicans are a racial and <i>cultural</i> mixture of European whites and American Indians, with a dash of African slaves thrown in for good measure, that has been going on for nearly 500 years. Which is the main reason "Mexican" is not a race. If you got technical about our race, most of us would be "mixed".<br /><br />The American Indians that precede us don't seem to have worn hats, though they did have feathered headdresses that the Spaniards found pretty impressive. I can't think of a codex or mural that mentions or illustrates hats, though I don't know if they used anything to cover their heads from the sun while working in the field.<br /><br />In any case, what <i>is</i> a product of European cultural conquest is the idea that it is improper to be seen in public with your head uncovered. Which is why Mexican men, like their English or American counterparts, wore hats all the time well into the 1950s or 60s: tricorne, top or fedora. <br />(In Spanish, all of those would be called types of "sombrero").<br />What most Americans call "sombrero", made of straw and with a cone-shaped crown, has little to do with the hats of mariachis (the musicians) or charros (the working cattle wranglers in need of a shade-giving garment). Though they do have a wide brim, Charro hats have a small round crown, are made of fur felt and are often embroidered with gold or silver thread. They're expensive, and thus associated with the wealthy cattle owners of North-central and Northern Mexico. <br />The cone-crowned straw hat, the one that condoms are supposed to resemble, can be seen in the murals of Diego Rivera and David Alfaro Siqueiros, and in photographs of supporters of revolutionary hero Emiliano Zapata. This hat is typical of the poor peasants and fieldworkers of south-central Mexico.<br />These people are precisely those who first migrated to the United States, and did so in larger numbers. This is why Mexicans in the US might feel the <i>sombrero</i> is a symbol of identity, and might not want it associated with condoms in a room full of immature teenagers.beatriznoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-32616691239026427032009-07-04T19:31:24.029-07:002009-07-04T19:31:24.029-07:00Teaching kids about safe sex is so trivial compare...Teaching kids about safe sex is so trivial compared to the great burning issue of our lifetime: to sombrero it or not to sombrero it...lol<br /><br />Well, just to be on the safe side, let's add "sombrero" to the list of words that white people must never utter again. <br /><br />@Raphne:<br /><br />"I'm a not-so-young white woman, so I don't think I get to declare that something is or isn't 'racist'" ...<br /><br />Did somebody pass a law to that effect? Even with a 24-hour news cycle I still hadn't heard about that.<br /><br /><br />And finally, this one from "anonymous":<br /><br />"Yes, that condom ad is racist. It plays up the whole "black guys all have huge penises" trope. Which comes from the black men are libidinous sex fiends trope. Which comes from the slavery era perceived threat of white women succumbing to black slaves.<br /><br />So yeah, pretty racist."<br /><br />Really? I'm SUCH a white person! I didn't realize that "sombrero" was an issue for black males in America. <br /><br />Let's just go with a "cowboy hat" theme and call it a day!Moira Fitzgeraldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10324897594685946435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-24303750860915216602009-07-04T06:21:16.979-07:002009-07-04T06:21:16.979-07:00I agree, Mike, that the Williams sisters bring far...I agree, Mike, that the Williams sisters bring far more to their tennis than merely power, and that other top players have been forced to focus more on physical power.<br /><br />My point was merely that this power has been what makes the Williams sisters most distinctive in competitive tennis. If commentators refer to it more often with them, and less often with their competitors, than they should, it is because sportscasters tend to be simplistic in their analysis and to harp on the same themes, over and over.Jameshttp://living.jdewperry.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-85092732882054811102009-07-04T05:54:05.949-07:002009-07-04T05:54:05.949-07:00@ James the other girls are
also muscular and pla...@ James the other girls are <br />also muscular and play a physical game nowadays, they have caught up, Dementieva was hitting the ball as hard as Serena in their match. Its not that power isn't part of the Williams game it is, but they also play with a lot of skill, guts, and <br />intelligence.<br /><br />But that is rarely mentioned by commentators and on tennis forums they just want to talk about the pwer and exaggerate it.Mikenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-70807748339860995912009-07-04T03:21:00.738-07:002009-07-04T03:21:00.738-07:00Holy condoms, Batman! (Bad pun, sorry.) I did no...Holy condoms, Batman! (Bad pun, sorry.) I did not think that this post would generate so many comments--this seems like one of those making a mountain out of a molehill problems.redcatbikerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08645491470348404443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-35086012192254939262009-07-03T23:04:49.186-07:002009-07-03T23:04:49.186-07:00What hat would take the sombrero's place? What...What hat would take the sombrero's place? What would qualify as a racially neutral hat? <br /><br />What is your immediate gut reaction to that question? <br /><br />That is where it gets interesting.<br /><br />For me, it is anything that is not considered a minority -- but what does that say about racism and it's relativism? What does it say about what we are discussing here, and the grounds and boundaries which we are debating on and within?SeasonVelvethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00039523140889823409noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-63254966795040274962009-07-03T22:44:33.064-07:002009-07-03T22:44:33.064-07:00It can't just be that the boss finds it racist...It can't just be that the boss finds it racist so it has to change. That is intellectually lazy, it gives too much power to someone who may not have assessed the situation as completely as (s)he could have. Maybe figure out why the boss thinks it is racist, and judge the merit of her/his argument. Otherwise there is no debate, and the conclusion reached, though it may be the correct one in the long run, was not fully thought out which decreases the chances that the correct decision is made.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-40969177048748189412009-07-03T22:34:59.426-07:002009-07-03T22:34:59.426-07:00(this is the same anonymous as the last comment)
...(this is the same anonymous as the last comment)<br /><br />In my previous comment I didn't really think about it, but it actually seems pretty ridiculous to compare a sombrero to a condom anyway.<br /><br />But saying it denigrates a Mexican symbol of pride, again, that is a meaning that people are ascribing to an object. The problem still does not lie in the object, it lies in the people that assume it is being used in a belittling way. Couldn't you just as easily view a condom as the key piece in a beautiful act, and therefore it would be an honor to be compared to a condom? Maybe you do not think so, but as I know you know, people have different viewpoints of the same thing. So again, the solution would not be getting rid of the sombrero as a reference, it would be changing people's views of condoms as just a "thin piece of plastic men put on their penises before sex" to something more positive.<br /><br />I don't think sombrero should be used because it is just a bad comparison. But if you think it is a good comparison, not using it would be taking the easy way out. If you replace it with a more white culture friendly image, where is the line? Does every object that may or may not conjure up "racish" thoughts but is itself just an object get replaced by something that does not conjure up these thoughts? In other words, something that fits in with the "normalcy of whiteness?" Isn't that just validating whiteness as having control over everyone's thoughts?<br /><br />I would like to hear your thoughts on why not using the sombrero reference (if considered a valid reference) does not empower "whiteness as normal."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-47838457816891277172009-07-03T22:08:31.092-07:002009-07-03T22:08:31.092-07:00If it is racist, then the commercial you showed at...If it is racist, then the commercial you showed at the end is just as racist. While it appears harmless, there is always the possibility that someone will see the black man with a really large common and think of the large penis stereotype. That seems to me to be the equivalent of calling the condom a sombrero and having some people think about Mexican/Latino stereotypes.<br /><br />It is inherently non-racist, the fact that people ascribe racist meanings to it does not make it racist, it makes them racist. Your focus (and I know it is) should be on changing racist perceptions of non-racist subjects, not the non-racist subjects.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-12543243324769370392009-07-03T03:39:54.766-07:002009-07-03T03:39:54.766-07:00Cheryl, like your "do i sound like an asshole...Cheryl, like your <i>"do i sound like an asshole"</i> test. <br /><br />Myblackfriendsays, also love "racish." <br /><br />And IMHO you make a strong point about <i>"...taking something that is a symbol of cultural pride ...and equating it with...penises"</i> but OTOH: to me it also feels like a win when we can make talking about race/culture/ethnicity feel natural & comfortable, when we can establish a context within which mention of things racial is assumed to come from a place of respect rather than otherwise (Ie, we acknowledge that ignorant ppl might be able to make this into something bad, but we leave that attitude, that thinking behind us.<br /> <br />I wouldn't want to underestimate the importance of learning to recognize and resist or change racism embedded in our language, but I also think that this positive approach has a place in the overall effort, and for this reason I *do* talk about race & culture, primarily with white people. I feel like every time we can mention (race-or-culture-specific item) in a respectful and “honoring” way, we’re that much further along to a time when it won’t occur to anyone to add the (childish snicker).<br /><br />Almost as if it’s beneath us to dignify that kind of thing by even acknowledging it; similar to how the Sex Ed teacher doesn’t avoid saying “penis” just because the kids are going to snicker, we can use matter-of-factness (about things that are merely race-related rather than racist) to work toward a new paradigm.<br /><br />I’m a white guy. For a few yrs I had a Mexican girlfriend and spent a lot of time immersed to a certain extent in “hispano” (ie, Mexican-American and Mexican) culture. The relevant point is that I heard the word “Mexican” used constantly; I loved the fact that it was virtually always spoken with an attitude of affection or pride, as opposed to the way white america often uses it (ie, faintly – or not-so-faintly – pejoratively.)<br /><br />As to the “sombrero” question itself, I’m reminded of an episode of The Office where something like the following (paraphrased) conversation took place between Michael (clueless white boss) and Oscar (Mexican-American employee):<br /><br />Michael: Do you prefer to be called something other than “Mexican”?<br /><br />Oscar: Why?<br /><br />Michael: Because “Mexican” has, well, you know… connotations.<br /><br />Oscar: Really? What connotations would that be?Robhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05089558800785760173noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-22011822379756736302009-07-02T23:56:36.297-07:002009-07-02T23:56:36.297-07:00I believe that the word, "sombrero" isn&...I believe that the word, "sombrero" isn't racist, but, given the way some White folks think, and, some Black folks, actually, the word may lead to negative associations. <br /><br />Honestly, call it what it is: a CONDOM.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-82114059843564850062009-07-02T13:12:56.966-07:002009-07-02T13:12:56.966-07:00macon: Interesting how many other commenters here ...macon: <i>Interesting how many other commenters here see little or no problem with comparing a condom to a sombrero.</i><br /><br />this is a bit of a simplification of my position (unless i'm misunderstanding). sure, outside the context of a sex ed class, and without the purpose of describing a very specific shape, an unsolicited comparison like that might rub me the wrong way. but we're talking about a very specific set of circumstances, in which the reason for using the term is explicitly stated. cheryl says it well that getting to explain "what i really mean" isn't a privilege one should assume they'll have. but aren't the presenters granted exactly that privilege when they walk onto the stage? the trick is to use it such that you pass the asshole test with flying colors.<br /><br />an example of failing this test would be to follow raphne's suggestion: i think the use of the term with a predominantly hispanic audience would actually be MORE of a problem, since it would suggest you're tailoring your presentation to suit your own racial preconceptions (especially if the hispanics in the audience aren't all mexican). and it would beg the question of whether you would use the same term with an audience of different ethnic makeup. the fact that it's a mixed audience only serves to strengthen the argument that the use of "sombrero" is race-neutral.<br /><br />similarly, myblackfriendsays makes an interesting point with regards to using "yarmulke" instead of "beanie," but this example is misleading because they signify a very different set of things. the yarmulke likely elicits as many ethnic connotations as a sombrero, but also bears the added weight of religious significance, which is undermined by using it in this context. now THAT'S a thorny issue, especially when one can use an equally effective but less charged descriptor. but i've yet to hear an alternative to "sombrero" that wasn't a long-winded clinical description that in all likelihood is already employed by the presenter, and simply reinforced by the sombrero comparison.<br /><br />i dunno, the further we get into the comments here, and the further we get into our own heads, the more it seems like the comparison being racist is a foregone conclusion and we're simply trying to justify why. but for all the thoughtful, interesting points being made, which apply very well to other situations, i've yet to see one that really applies <i>here</i>.<br /><br />sorry for another long comment. i'm long-winded :)drspamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09551440487583308969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-528074983146803930.post-73853802756939245132009-07-02T08:02:45.466-07:002009-07-02T08:02:45.466-07:00Thank you Jules, and yes, I think that long commen...Thank you Jules, and yes, I think that long comments, like long blog posts, do get read less often than shorter ones. If you mentioned in your first comment that you're Hispanic, I missed it too (in fact, in rereading it, I've missed it again). That said, here's another long comment!<br /><br />You wrote,<br /><br /><i>I am offended that this post and its subsequent comments seem unable to grasp that while Mexicans are Hispanic, not all Hispanics are Mexican. Seriously, there are (rough guess, not gonna grab a pen and math it out) 16 other countries in Latin America, and all of them are represented within the Hispanic community within the US.</i><br /><br />I appreciate the corrective that "Latin American/Hispanic" does not equal "from Mexico." Still, this post is about the word sombrero, and as you said in your first comment, while "sombreros are not commonly worn in Mexico," they "are from Mexico." More to the point, whatever their precise origins, they're associated with Mexico in the collective American imagination, along with a lot of stereotypes about "Mexicans." What I do think the post could have made more clear is that those stereotypes are often extended as well to Hispanics/Latin Americans in general, along with the common assumption that all such people are from Mexico (this reminds me of the surprise sometimes expressed upon learning that this or that person is not from Mexico -- this seems like a potential topic for a post -- "assume Latin Americans are from Mexico"?).<br /><br />Actually, that those stereotypes are extended to all Latin Americans is what I was sort of getting at in this part of the conversation with Terry:<br /><br /><i>“Also, a sombrero is considered a Mexican thing, right? So, let’s say that you have someone in the class who’s from Mexico, or even somewhere else, in Latin America? Or what if they’re just, Latin American, period?” [With that last sentence, I was thinking also about people who have roots in the U.S. stretching back to before there even was a "United States"]<br /><br />“Yes, that happens. I do have students like that when I’m presenting.”<br /><br />“So, I think it’s possible that you’re singling those students out with that word. I mean, the idea of a sombrero might bring that student to mind for the other students. They might even turn around and look at that student, or like, smile or smirk while they’re thinking about a sombrero, and also thinking about that student.”</i><br /><br />I think this could happen (and it could feel bad) whether or not the Latin American student has Mexican origins. But then, that's just a guess on my part.<br /><br />Finally, your insights into the colonialist origins of sombreros (however snarky) are interesting. You wrote, <br /><br /><i>The word sombrero originally described hats worn by Spaniards, and is still used elsewhere in Latin America to describe wide brimmed hats.</i><br /><br />Does that mean that prior to the intrusions of the Spanish, Mexicans didn't have sombreros? That sombreros are actually not an authentic Mexican thing? (And btw, is this just general knowledge you have? If not, what's your source for this?)macon dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07795547197817128339noreply@blogger.com